Q&A with Trinity Cathedral Deans Past and Present:
What is Means to be an Episcopalian Today
On the occasion of Bishop Nicholas Knisley’s visit to Trinity Cathedral, we asked him to join with Dean Emerita Rebecca McClain and Dean Troy Mendez in reflecting on what it means to be an Episcopalian and a part of a Cathedral community in today’s world. Here are their responses to a series of thoughtful questions posed by Alison Moran, Chapter Clerk and Chair of the Trinity 20s and 30s.
The Right Reverend Nicholas Knisley
Bishop of Rhode Island and
former Dean of Trinity Cathedral
Bishop of Rhode Island and
former Dean of Trinity Cathedral
What does the cathedral of the future look like?
I’ve always believed that Cathedrals hold a special place in the lives of the dioceses in which they are placed. They serve as a sort of flagship for the bishop, a place where one can observe liturgical best practices and musical offerings. They often have a vibrant congregational life, but in addition to that are the second church home for everyone in the diocese, lay and ordained. I imagine that this will remain unchanged. But how that is expressed might change as new ways of connecting, both in person and virtually, start to emerge.
Additionally, it’s often said that Cathedrals, by virtue of their locations, are a place where the sacred work of the Church most often directly engages the secular life of the community they serve. It’s a sort of crossroad that serves in equal parts as a worship AND community center. I think as congregations and dioceses begin to plan for the next century of their ministry, they should be intentional about what needs to happen to support that special vocation. Things like digital footprints, flexible gathering spaces, and physical fabric should all be planned to support this unique dual vocation.
How do we balance our responsibility to maintain the church building for future generations with our call to serve a world in need?
We are an incarnate people, embodied and present in the world. I think it’s a mistake to set worship and a sense of place over and against a need to care for the physical needs of the poor. Without a centered spiritual life, any work or effort to create a better condition for the entire community often loses its focus and becomes self-serving or self-perpetuating rather than using the revelation of God’s desire for humanity as its North Star. People find God by serving the needs of the community, and people find the strength to serve by finding God in worship. In my own experience there have been times when I’ve worshiped so that I could continue to serve. There have also been times when my faith has been troubled and my service in the community fostered my spiritual discipline to continue to worship.
I think imagining a conflict between the need for a place to worship and a place to serve weakens both.
How do we both minister to those who think faith in God is for the ignorant while also reaching those who think the Episcopal Church is elitist?
By demonstrating with our actions that both views are mistaken. Part of the reason it’s important for people who have been given the gift of an education or who have achieved some sort of notable success to be open about their faith is to counter the first view. It’s a large part of why the religious order that I’ve made life-vows to: the Society of Ordained Scientists, exists. We think of ourselves as the counter-example to the first idea that educated people cannot seriously believe in the Gospel.
The second is like unto it… It’s why it’s important for the Episcopal Church to be on the vanguard of reaching out to people on the margins. By having a diverse community, economically, racially and politically, we can demonstrate to people who think we are the community that exists only to serve the needs of the 1%.
What is the role of the cathedral in social justice work?
Frankly? To lead. Given that most cathedrals are in downtown urban settings that are places where the homeless gather in larger numbers or where there are significant numbers of people from marginalized communities, to care for their community is to be in the front of local and regional justice work. Additionally, because of their role in the larger diocesan network, cathedrals can be a gathering place and a laboratory for programs that respond to human need. What works in the cathedral neighborhood can often be replicated in other church settings – and vice versa.
What is our greatest opportunity as we emerge from the pandemic?
We need to take seriously what we have accomplished in these difficult days. Other communities and organizations have struggled to continue operating and while we have faced challenges, for the most part Episcopal congregations have continued, and some have even thrived. We talk ourselves down a lot. I think we should recognize that we have more resiliency and creativity than we (and others) expected. Keeping that in mind will help us to respond to the challenges the next decades will bring, rather than entering into a mindset that there is no future for us or for the Church.
The Very Reverend Rebecca McClain
Trinity Cathedral Dean Emerita
What does the cathedral of the future look like?
In general, cathedrals will continue to be beacons of hope, especially in urban centers, representing the highest aspirations of compassion, mercy, justice and love as expressed through worship, faithful service, prayer, spiritual formation — a contemplative life that translates into action in the world.
Cathedrals are outposts and signposts to a better way, a more excellent way of living in community. We must become better at gathering, affirming and engaging new members and more visible in the cities and towns where we live and serve. I believe that in the future, smaller congregations will struggle to survive, and cathedrals must become more robust and clear about our purpose in the world — we are living signs of God’s love and must be witnesses to that love.
There can never be a day where the doors are locked and there is nothing happening. Our future must continue to be in the world, not a fortress to keep the world at bay, and our witness is as a sacrament to the world.
How do we balance our responsibility to maintain the church building for future generations with our call to serve a world in need?
We must do both — this is a false dichotomy. How can we bear witness if we are not good stewards of the church buildings? If we see that our buildings are part of our witness and identity — they inspire, comfort, energize, gather — they are the nest, the sacred home and hearth that is a crucial part of our humanity — these spaces allow community to form. Edward O. Wilson, the world’s leading social biologist defines social species as those that create the nest, the hive, the home. Humans are, by our very DNA, social creatures.
It’s time to quit apologizing for our buildings and, instead become better stewards of them and more creative in their use. That is part of our service in the world. An example from Trinity’s past was when the children of Rosie’s House were invited to practice and perform in our space — they were allowed to play the beautiful Bosendorffer piano and experience the wonder of this great acoustic space. That was a gift of remarkable value. For these children, this was a transformative experience — many of those who participated are now adults and I have heard from them that this was life changing. The space itself inspires!
How do we both minister to those who think faith in God is for the ignorant while also reaching those who think the Episcopal Church is elitist?
We continue to offer our very best and authentic selves through our beautiful worship and the experiences that come from entering our doors. The more people who come our way, the more these issues disappear. We are intellectually curious by nature, and we have the capacity to engage and speak the language of the market, the academy, and the regular people. We must become more fluent in these other language domains and better at translating our own domain of spiritual/existential language.
What is the role of the cathedral in social justice work?
To preach the gospel and to go forth into the world, living, loving, giving, and serving. It is part of our mandate to establish the best partnerships with other agencies — thereby maximizing impact whenever possible. This is different from responding to the day-to-day challenges that many cathedrals face as urban dwellers. In these cases, we look at the needs and our capacity. That will vary from place to place. Social justice work is also part of the proclamation of the gospel and so we must engage in word and deed — it is about what we say and what we do. We must be consistent, authentic, and prophetic.
What is our greatest opportunity as we emerge from the pandemic?
People are longing for community after being locked down for two years and are ready to gather with others. We need to open our doors as often as we can and provide opportunities to welcome the stranger. We must get better at helping people enter into our space, especially our liturgical experience. It isn’t easy for those who are not cradle born Episcopalians and we must provide the tools to help them follow along and/or be willing to sit with a newcomer to provide a presence of care, and finally, we must be fluent in our various roles — reading, serving, greeting, guiding, explaining who we are and what we believe.
We have this beautiful campus at Trinity and now is the time to practice radical hospitality. More public interest programs, more experiences with art and music, more small group opportunities and a continuing effort to welcome the stranger will all be necessary in this time of reentering the post pandemic world.
We already do so many things well, but this is an unprecedented time and opportunity to once again rise out of the ashes!
The Very Reverend Troy Mendez
Dean of Trinity Cathedral
What does the cathedral of the future look like?
We’ve learned a great deal from the COVID pandemic, primarily that a church community isn’t necessarily tied to a building, but rather exists where worship, fellowship, and service happen. Obviously, our ministry center will continue to be an actual cathedral campus, but the cathedral of the future will need to imagine the possibilities of connecting many communities together for all of them to serve in common ministries beneficial to their respective interests. This might be achieved with help from electronic communication platforms, but it will also be achieved by developing strong bonds of community life while physically present at church, while in the home, and in every aspect of a person’s life–both in-person and virtual. The opportunities for cathedrals to coordinate ministries for large metropolitan areas are endless, and the past strengths of cathedral communities will only help them in greater ways in the future.
How do we balance our responsibility to maintain the church building for future generations with our call to serve a world in need?
Every community of people must have a meeting space. A cathedral is not only a meeting space for a congregation but is also a space for a diocese to gather clergy and leaders in ministry together for worship and for learning. To fully live into the traditions of worship and learning in the Anglican/Episcopal tradition, buildings need to be maintained at a standard that is pleasant, safe, and inviting. The building and campus are not the ministry but do serve as the catalyst for it. To solidify best practices of ministry, a cathedral campus needs to have a firm footing in realizing first and foremost that it is a sign and a vehicle of God’s beloved community here on earth. Being a steward of what we have inherited from our ancestors will allow us to not only maintain a beautiful cathedral campus but will inspire us to reach out for greater possibilities to bring God’s beloved community to others. We pray together in the Book of Common Prayer, “Send us out to do the work you have given us to do.” The cathedral campus itself is a visible reminder to us that we are always sent by God into a world that is in need. God expects each one of us, because of our prayers, to identify those in need and to serve the world with an abundant portion of God’s love.
How do we both minister to those who think faith in God is for the ignorant while also reaching those who think the Episcopal Church is elitist?
As Mother Teresa said, “We can do no great things. We can only do small things with great love.” Love is absolutely the answer. The Episcopal Church has a great deal of work to do in broadening our ability to communicate Christ’s message of love to a broader society. The truth of the matter is that many people in society do not connect to the Episcopal Church because they do not understand it. In order for future generations to dispel these perceptions of being elitist, it will be imperative for the Episcopal Church to work on how members of the church relate to God, relate to one another, and relate to their neighbors in their communities. By building bridges relationally between churches and neighborhoods, this false perception of elitism will be replaced with a perception of collaboration and trust. This, in turn, will lead to a greater understanding of the Episcopal Church by greater numbers of people in society.
What is the role of the cathedral in social justice work?
Cathedrals are the springboard for ideas on how the church can interact with the world. Many cathedrals in the United States are located in decaying urban centers. Population shifts have left their neighborhoods neglected and forgotten by their elected officials. While Trinity in Phoenix has seen its share of societal highs and lows, its members have been deeply touched by the cries of those who are marginalized in society. No one in America has to go very far to observe someone who is experiencing homelessness. It isn’t hard to see that children in our local neighborhoods are going to bed hungry at night. The very nature of the global economy has continued to create deep chasms between rich and poor.
Cathedrals experience these shifts more than any other type of congregation, due to their natural position as gathering points. This makes them well-positioned to begin addressing the needs they see in their community. With respect to social justice, cathedrals are best utilized as places to gather and wrestle with the unsolvable issues of our day. Cathedrals have the capacity to gather many congregations into a united effort to address the needs of society. The experiences of cathedral congregations can be used to help champion the needs of the most vulnerable so that the city of tomorrow can more closely mirror the beloved community that Jesus proclaims for the world.
What is our greatest opportunity as we emerge from the pandemic?
The greatest opportunity post-pandemic is to commit to building a solid community life. This means that as the faith community has changed since early 2020, we owe it to ourselves to re-shape our life in new ways. The author John Stott describes a healthy Christian fellowship in this way: “A healthy Christian fellowship includes people of all types, backgrounds, and ages, and there are new depths of friendship and mutual sharing to be discovered.”
As the people of Trinity Cathedral emerge from this pandemic, they are called to emerge with a renewed commitment to our mission: Welcoming all to be transformed in Christ through worship, fellowship, and service. The vision and goals that were formed pre-pandemic need to be modified to capture a spirit of innovation that has taken place in our community since the beginning of the pandemic. As we have literally re-written the “playbook” of how we are the church each week, the people of Trinity continue to develop new ideas that will broaden our perspective for effective ministry in the future. Our common goals need to be refined to meet the needs of the future — a future that looks quite different in our eyes than it did in early 2020. We have a solid foundation at Trinity which allows us to re-imagine ourselves as we emerge from this pandemic, but we absolutely must look at building solid community life as our greatest opportunity. The time is now to re-imagine the ways in which we pray together. The time is also now to refine the ways in which we gather either in-person or virtually, that God may continually send us out in peace to love and serve, with gladness and singleness of heart. The post-pandemic community focuses on loving God and abiding in that presence of love together, so that all may see and be inspired by the presence of Christ’s beloved community at the corner of Central and Roosevelt.